You have no basis for your assumption that 3/4 of the people here have never dealt with blacklists before. Who are you to judge us? We are not the only people on the Internet with these complaints (I assume you took the time to read the lengthy discussions on planetmike).

1. You are correct that it is not Microsoft’s responsibility to monitor my mail flow. Matter of fact, I want them to leave it alone. My mail servers were installed and configured by me over 10 years ago. They are fine and never listed by any blacklist until 88.blacklist.zap came around and arbitrarily nuked them as well as some non-mail server IP addresses.

2. I don’t care about how many people use an inferior system. Just because people bought Corvairs, it didn’t make it a safe car. Poor products that do the wrong thing are just that — poor products. We will continue to point it out.

3. We all know about exploitable relays. Fact is, that never happened and yes I have the mail logs to prove it. I asked Microsoft to back up their claims and they refused.

You know all about E-mail and SPAM, but you mentioned a toll free E-mail address! What the heck is that?

If you received a filter log from Microsoft, then you are the first person on the entire Internet community to ever get one. They have told us time and time again that they do not have logs and cannot and will not provide them for any reason. Perhaps you are more closely related to Microsoft than we are!?

You’ve got to be kidding about 88.blacklist.zap being around longer than we have and having listed our IP addresses before we got them. That is the dumbest thing I have ever heard, but possibly true given the stupidity of their systems. This would mean that once a system enters their cave it never comes out. No culling of information which means it is 100% unreliable and indefensible.

Mail logs are our responsibility. That is why we are fighting mad about this. We have the logs that say we are clean, and they are preventing legal businesses from executing E-mail transactions. They have a legal responsibility under U.S. law to document their bahavior just like we do. I can show that no SPAM has left my servers over the entire time that they had them blacklisted. If Microsoft cannot and will not do the same, then they should be shut down until they can comply. We live in the USA, where everyone is assumed innocent until proven guilty. Microsoft has no demonstrable proof, data or information that shows my E-mail server ever delivered a single piece of SPAM. They are violating laws and rights of everyone, including their own customers, from using the Internet for legal commerce purposes. That is just illegal and unethical.

3/4 of the people here have not really dealt with a real black list before… It’s not a hard concept

1) It is not Microsoft’s responsibility to monitor your mail flow
2) More people use EHS/FOSE/Exchange Hosted Services via its reseller channels than you probably know.
3) Spam Can be targeted via exploitable relays patching doesn’t always fix that.

If you’ve been smart enough to use a search engine to determine 88.blacklist.zap is associated with Microsoft, your smart enough to find their toll free email address. I’ve been listed by them before to, and after working with them and asking for filtering logs… They provided them, and guess what? They were accurate and actually proved that I was spamming despite my claims of not being open relay etc.

You also have to remember, chances are 88.blacklist.zap has been around longer than you’ve had the IP in use and could have been listed before that time.

Ultimately.. Mail Logs are your responsibility, and being they process BILLIONS of messages a day, they won’t keep their logs for ever and expecting them to do so is more absurb them pretending you’re mail server or IP was never compromised at any point in its history

Those lists are fully illegal in many countries of civilized areas, because enlisted people have this right to delist, but their managers do not care about that…Specially when they can’t prove any harm from your server to them…I don’t care about some weakness on mine that WOULD create some casualties on third parties servers. My point is I didn’t do anything, any spam to them or one of their customers, so why should I be blacklisted?
Unfortunately, I have really no time, and it’s their chance, to play with them, because I don’t need a class action against them I’ll do a simple regular lawsuit, that all they desserve. I run for email servers for law offices, then one day it could happen

I’m the gateway admin for a global corporation (meaning I have some exposure to blocklists and email gateways) and a few weeks ago we found out that our email’d purchase orders to one of our suppliers (another large global corp), were being blocked by 88.blacklist.zap with the same nondescript and poorly worded responses as above.

Following protocol, I dropped a note to the delist email addy at delist@frontbridge.com and was promptly advised by return that the IP will not be delisted until the amount of spam coming through it decreases…

OK…

I requested a copy of the spam and headers for perusal – this was refused (I was told they were not accessible – what sort of nonsense is this?).

I advised that the IP in question (blocked by 88.blacklist.zap) was in fact a router IP belonging to our upstream Telco so it couldn’t be directly responsible for sending spam… Unfortunately I then was given the impression the “technician” I was conversing with really had no idea what I was talking about… He simply refused to acknowledge that such a thing was possible.

OK – enough time wasted – the way we managed this was simple – we advised our supplier we would continue doing business with them if and when they changed their email hosting provider. They now have – problem solved – we spend $ millions with them and aren’t about to continue with this sort of crap.

You will also see that attempts were made to nicely contact Frontbridge and determine the cause. Frontbridge would not provide any info to either party in these email transactions. This means that no corrective actions on either side could be taken short of the customer relocating their mail to another hosting system.

Anyone that runs anti-spam software knows that all anti-span software produces false positives.

This is why every other blacklisting facility that I’m aware of, other than Frontbridge, provides mechanisms for problem determination and resolution.

I guess that the post office never delivered your mail to someone else either.

cheers.